Goodbye!

[boozehound]

i suppose what i meant to say was tht the bmw wont be as reliable as a toyota

[Speed_Chaser]

i suppose what i meant to say was tht the bmw wont be as reliable as a toyota

Do you really think so? I haven't experienced much of reliability with my Auris so far,

and am allready thinking of the time when my warranty will end. It scares me as I do

still have same problems which I had in the beginning (1,5 years ago). Maybe Toyota

won't cause me any big/serious troubles and will only have these "small" bugs, but it's

pretty annoying when your car just doesn't feel like it should. I am sure BMW won't

have this kind of issues as it is much more expensive car and the quality is better.

But I don't deny that BMW can cause some bigger problems on the long run.

On the other hand, you don't know anything for sure about Auris/Toyota neither.

Nowadays almost everyone has to save on parts, some just have to or try to, save more

than they could, and that's where all the problems start...

Best regards, Alex

[OldSkoO1]

i suppose what i meant to say was tht the bmw wont be as reliable as a toyota

I am sure BMW won't have this kind of issues as it is much more expensive car and the quality is better.

But I don't deny that BMW can cause some bigger problems on the long run.

BMW have a much higher level of perceived quality on the outside, on the inside BMW aren't necessarily matching the outside quality. It depends how you interpret it.

The way i see it is Toyota build their cars conservatively they don't push the boundaries of possibility. They don't do anything that they calculate that could compromise reliability and they build their cars for the long run which means keeping mechanical stresses to a minimum, basically taking no chances.

BMW on the other hand innovate, the closest competitor Mercedes consistently come out with new technology which BMW strive to keep up with and eclipse by have strategic advantages in other areas like engine performance. BMW of course put all their cars through vigorous testing but they push boundaries to have that advantage which gives they respect, brand recognition and orders.

The summarized differences are, BMW innovate, they push boundaries of engineering and come up with extraordianry achievements that win them awards and admiration but in doing so their design docs must show more probability of fault or failure where as toyota's design docs are likely to show the least probability of fault or failure in comparison by design.

Neither design is certain to fail but the margins are certainly different but having said that there is nothing to suggest BMW will fail.

This is all in my opinion and was the result of a conversation i had with a friend of mine who has worked for a number of manufacturers over 30 years from Aerospace work to now working at Landrover. When working in Japan he explained how everyone from the company bosses to the managers, mechanics all sat in board rooms discussing the merits of using certain types of wiring and electrical connectors and the most (what we would class) insignificant of components. He also experienced the same ethos when he saw the bosses on their backs in car foot wells seeing how the connectors are being used.

To complicate matters further the push for emissions reduction and this isn't just co2 reduction is over complicating both diesel and petrol engines and has been for some time. There is a lot more scope for failure or faults to occur especially with diesels running at such high pressure that you just cant protect against regardless of design. You see how Audi have been trying to exploit this concept with precise "eye of the needle" fuel injection advertising (here in the UK). I see that as expensive problems 60k down the line if the car has limited tolerances or people don't keep the compression and exhaust heat high enough over those 60k miles.

Anyway - a little off topic, i still hope he enjoys his car, well, i know he will, it is an engineering masterpiece even if it isn't the magic of its twin turbo brother. As long as it is left to cool down and he doesn't ask too much when cold and the production line did its job and nothing is loose he will have an absolute ball with that.

[boozehound]

i couldnt have said it any better

[Karma Supra]

Good choice ;)

It sorry to see but a few of us seem to be moving away now, I really wanted to stay loyal to Toyota after owning 9 in the past but they simply don't do anything that suited me anymore!

BMW as a company seem very good about warranty claims and their "goodwill" scheme is excellent, - I had a spring fail on my M3 that was well out of warranty, and they replaced parts FOC.

When it comes to new tyres time, everyone on the Forums say that the enjoyability and drivability goes up tenfold if they get rid of the horrid runflat tyres! Worth a try! M cars don't come with them for a reason!

Nice to not see a single "BMW Driver" comment either!