Satnav/entertainment System Dead

[shcm]

Definitely the right unit of course.

It shouldn't need programming as such, it will just need the DVD in it when it is powered up (and that is probably in the old one ).

Anyway, hang fire, I've got some suggestions, but want to check something first and also need to go and do a few chores now. Back Later.

[bitman]

I have options now and have stopped worrying you guys have been great(put my mind at ease) it's good to know you can have some support with a car (especially when you get none from the manufacturer).

your welcome, thats the power of internet & forums

[shcm]

I have options now................

You've got some more - have a look at your personal messenger (PM).

[bothwell_buyer]

eeehhhhhhhhhh

am still waiting to see if we can swap cars..................... I'll even throw in a free AA map.

[vikkij]

eeehhhhhhhhhh

am still waiting to see if we can swap cars..................... I'll even throw in a free AA map.

Noooooooooooooooo... :P

Blame Anchorman and Shcm, they have made me stop seeing red and begin to love the car again. Saying that... throw in £13,000 a £500 hairdressing voucher and my Christmas shopping bought and it's yours (You'll need the AA road map)

[shcm]

Right, a bit of an update on this and perhaps some useful info if your satnav should fail.

You might have gathered from another post, that Vikkij's satnav has been fixed :).

In the process of doing this, I contacted the satnav manufacturer (Aisin), to see if there was any technical service info available. (It's always easier if you've got a schematic or two). Needless to say, they were not forthcoming with anything, but it is always worth a try.

However, I did learn that they have an out of warranty satnav repair/exchange unit programme with Mr T.

The attached files, perhaps make interesting reading. The biggest repair cost is for an exchange unit - about 1200 euros - which is certainly not the approx £1400 Toyota were quoting Vikkij. The other repair costs are considerably less.

Perhaps, we have to be charitable (although maybe the dealer wasn't). Maybe the dealer wasn't aware of the repair service, but why wasn't Toyota GB? Perhaps this service only applies to mainland Europe, but that would be a bit odd (and non-European) in my opinion.

There is a fixed diagnosis charge involved, so maybe the dealer doesn't want to be left funding that, should the customer decide they don't want the unit replaced/repaired after all. However, all that could be explained to the customer surely??

So what problem did I find with Vikkij's satnav? Vikkij tells me that I am talking in "martian" :). So in the interests of trying to improve my plain English, all I can say is that it was all down to this little bit of liquorice, worth less than a 0.5p chew.

DealerLetter.pdf

SatNavRepairPrices.pdf

[anchorman]

609 and 620 look like they've been changed. What do you think made them go?

[local hero]

609 and 620 look like they've been changed. What do you think made them go?

Why can you not accept that the boys a genius? even i can see that 2 of those little widgets have been tampered with, now we are going to get a full explanation in Martian..

[shcm]

Ok then, martian coming up. Insert your bablefish in ear.

I have to confess that the tamperer of R609 and R620 was me. They look a bit rough, but they are OK. My soldering is not as good as reflow , but remember that those things are 1.5mm x 0.75mm. I can do better with a finer tipped iron.

The problem was with half of RA602, which is 4 resistors in a pack. That too has been messed with by me, but looks better.

It doesn't look it from the tracking shown in the picture, but R609 and R620 are related to part of the circuit with RA602. I had to remove them to confirm what was going on.

So what was going on? Advanced martian coming up.

RA602 has developed a "partial short" across two of its pins. The result of which was the main microprocessor was held in reset (probably in reset, - it wasn't a nice clean logic level). It was never going to work if it wasn't in reset, because the other effect was a pin on the microprocessor, which determines whether it runs from external memory or internal flash memory, was in the wrong state.

The "partial short" is slightly puzzling. There are several possibilities. A couple are:

1. Electronics has moved to lead free soldering. Automotive electronics was exempt for a while, but this is a lead free board. If you don't take care, the lead free process can produce tin whiskers, which was less of a problem with old lead soldering. Perhaps there was a very thin whisker there, which moved slightly under temperature/humdity change etc. Unfortuately the iron went onto the joint before I looked for anything like this and then it was fixed, so I will never know. There is also some question of the reliability of lead free solder joints compared with leaded.

Lead free rant - I've never been convinced this is a good move. OK lead is not nice stuff, but it was put in there for a reason. We also recycle electronics now, so it doesn't get buried. I suppose it could being recycled in places where regulations don't care about the workforce. The lead-free stuff usually needs a higher peak temperature on the reflow soldering profile or a different profile which added other complications. OK, I'm just a luddite - rant over.

2. I hope it is not this one. You can get dendritic grow between points at different DC potentials. This can cause circuit paths that shouldn't be there. It can usually be seen. It worse when a voltage is applied all of the time. Part of this circuit is that case - it has a constant DC voltage.

Worse is something called CAF:

http://www.ami.ac.uk/courses/topics/0152_caf/index.html

This grow along the glass fibres the board is made from on inner print circuit board layers (inner layers also have circuit tracks on them) and is almost impossible to spot. It never used to be much of a problem, but as components and spacings have got smaller, it has to be considered and guarded against it. Telecoms have know about it for years, but they operate at higher voltages. The growth rate is proportional to voltage. It grows, but can be destroyed with high current or possibly heat etc. It can drive you crazy if you have it in a PCB and don't realise.

Remove your babelfish.

[bitman]

nice 1

what about silver soldering what i always use (coming from high end audio back ground)?

[anchorman]

the lead free process can produce tin whiskers

Come on own up - who's been using lead free solder on the mother in law's chin?

........and another thing clever clogs. Did you remember to put some more Pepsi in the flux capacitor while you were at it?

[shcm]

........and another thing clever clogs. Did you remember to put some more Pepsi in the flux capacitor while you were at it?

No, I filled it full of ice-cream (Häagen-Dazs). It's the best thing for your satnav - cools it down and makes it run faster.

In fact, I recommend you spoon it into all of your electronic equipment. You know it makes sense!

[vikkij]

........and another thing clever clogs. Did you remember to put some more Pepsi in the flux capacitor while you were at it?

No, I filled it full of ice-cream (Häagen-Dazs). It's the best thing for your satnav - cools it down and makes it run faster.

In fact, I recommend you spoon it into all of your electronic equipment. You know it makes sense!

You are a star!!!!

I still didn't understand the martian speak though I have read it 3 times

I certainly wouldn't recommend ACDC for the sat/nav! ;)

Oooo which flavour Haagan Dazs? (check you out spelling it all correctly and putting the 2 dots over the a!!!!!)

[shcm]

You are a star!!!!

Fanks!

I still didn't understand the martian speak

Nah, me neither. Dunno where it all comes from.

Oooo which flavour Haagan Dazs?

I suppose it has to match some of the contributors on this forum, so something with nuts in it! ;).

(Warning, this forum may does contain nuts!)

[abraxas]

Right, a bit of an update on this and perhaps some useful info if your satnav should fail.

You might have gathered from another post, that Vikkij's satnav has been fixed :).

...

You're pretty cool Beavis. !

Amazing post on the other topic too.

[shcm]

You're pretty cool Beavis. !

Not that cool, I've still not done much with that joggler :fishyface:

(couldn't think of any replies with "Butt-head" references that wouldn't have the potential to appear offensive either :)).

[peteg2005]

I have a Dec 2005 Rav4 XT5 and the radio/ dat nav unit has also died. The problem appeared for first time last night, however this morning I turned the unit on without starting the engine and it worked for a minute or so, was able to open front and remove CD / DVDs, Then died again.

So I guess similar component failure - I don't want to have to buy new unit via Toyota - are there any electronics repair gurus in the SE of England?

[DJ FA]

Hi i have a problème with my 9002, the radio is off, i have only noise, can you help me ? thx.

[shcm]

I appreciate English is probably not your first language, but can you give a bit more detail please? I really can't help much without more info.

Is there any display at all?

You say you have noise. Is that normal background "radio off tune" type noise? Is the antenna connected?

[DJ FA]

Hi, all display it's ok, cd it's ok, gps i think is'ok,

but the radio is off, the antenne is connected off course.

I listen only of the noise without music as shhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

Thx.

[shcm]

So the radio doesn't work?

I'm not familiar with the Verso set up, but I expect there is a preamp somewhere. Possibly it is faulty, but I'd still expect some reception, even with a faulty pre-amp or antenna lead.

Try disconnecting the antenna, and put the end of about 1 meter of wire in the antenna socket centre pin. If still no reception, then maybe the radio module has failed. Very difficult to diagnose on limited information.

These people might be able to repair it for you. I'm not recommending them though, as I have never used them:

http://www.mapleaudio.co.uk/

[DJ FA]

Ok thx but it is too expensive.