My Turn! (Headgasket)

[gug]

hi again all, well it seems my time has come to hopefully get a replacement engine due to head gasket failure on my T180. Theres just a few question i have about procedure of getting sorted.

1. My car has 74k and has just passed 4 years old, was serviced all its life at main dealer religously with the last one at 69k in Jan 11. what is the service schedule for mine or do you wait for the service light to come up, i know its over a year since last service but the car was stood up on the forecourt for 6 months does this make a difference?

2. who do i contact for going down my warantee, my dealer or do i need to call Toyota direct ( number please )?

symptoms are pretty much the same as all previous, cooling fan running constant which ive not had before, water all over rocker cover inc alot of water over engine bay ( water obviously blowing out header tank) red temp light on dash comes on everytime you use the turbo at all (goes from nothing to flashing red to constantly on) until today the only symptoms i had was a bit too much pressure in water system after a run, would spill its guts if you release the cap even after about an hour, and i also had the gurgling in heater matrix

put sniff tester on and fluid went green

so thanks for any help in advance to helping me solve my problems

[cabcurtains]

The car should be serviced every year or 10k which ever comes first.

As a starter you should go to your local Mr T and explain the issue, there are a number of steps and tests required before they will start anything.

[gug]

The car should be serviced every year or 10k which ever comes first.

As a starter you should go to your local Mr T and explain the issue, there are a number of steps and tests required before they will start anything.

Well i hope they dont expect me to pay for the diagnosis, when both me and my brother are qualified mechanics with 20years in the trade ( hence why i have a sniff tester ) , with HG being a massive problem on these engines it doesnt take a rocket scientist to work out whats wrong with it, white smoke,overheating and being sick all over engine bay but no visible leaks anywhere else and drinking getting on for 2 litres of water for a 40mile trip half motorway (time of the month i do a motorway run to clear DPF)

if i do pay for diagnosis does it get reimbursed under the warrentee

thanks

[cabcurtains]

Its pretty normal to get it all sorted without expense, but as per normal procedure you will have to play the game with your local Mr T as they have to prove to Toyota UK a warranty claim is valid. They will assess the service history, have a look in RAV forum if you havent already at Charlies guide, he's had 2 engines recently.

Please keep us posted on what happens, if its carbon related you may get an engine as its not possible to skim the head.

You can get the TSB from here if you havent seen it http://www.toyotaownersclub.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=132277&st=0

[gug]

cheers bud

well my egr unit has been cleaned a few months ago would this have any effect on the outcome or from what i can read its to do with carbon deposits elsewhere i.e pistons ect.

going by the state of my egr valve before cleaning if the rest of the inlet is in that state it maybe due to that, ( there wasnt enough room to slot a penny in the egr before it was cleaned

[gug]

taken into local toyota this morning, they said they will check it out see if its "to spec for warrentee claim" and said would call back this afternoon to let me know whats going on. No call and i left a message still no call, will this be a good sign or a bad sign! also how good a battle do i have to put to get a courtesy car as they said they had none till march!!!

wish me luck

[cabcurtains]

Hmm, back to how good your dealer is then!

CC's are tricky if they are all booked out you will have to wait, either that or tell them to get you an Enterprise Mini Mobile for £10 a day.

[gug]

quick update

they called back today , said water pump leaking ( load of rubbish, never had a spot of water on painted garage floor since ive had the car unless rain/snow ect) never lost a drop of water until last week and still no leaks on floor. said HG has definately failed and is overpressuring water system ( could this large pressure blow my water pump?)

went to get my kiddie seats out the car and asked for technician to show me water pump leak "cant see it in this light buts stained underneath" then explained to him that when the car has spilled its guts with the fans on that half of the engine bay gets soaked with the water being blown everywhere. I also asked the service manager and technician to what would be replaced HG or engine, which the reply was that it so say depends on the criteria on which it would be.( anybody know how/what gets investigated?)

from past stories ive not known of any of the HG problems being solved by just replacing HG ( speak up if you have) due to being all ali engine

have gave them permission to strip engine and investigate ( seems normal practice, going by the stories on here.)

so hopefully should get some good news in the next couple of day

cheers

[Mistermena]

Keep us informed of how your getting on mate. Hope all goes well...

[Mistermena]

The reason why you cant just change the HG on these is because of "Shuffle" Ormi has posed many pic's on the subject! It has to be a new 3/4 engine! If they say the're gonna just change the HG then I'd be asking some very searching questions!!!

Keep us informed of how your getting on mate. Hope all goes well...

[gug]

The reason why you cant just change the HG on these is because of "Shuffle" Ormi has posed many pic's on the subject! It has to be a new 3/4 engine! If they say the're gonna just change the HG then I'd be asking some very searching questions!!!

Keep us informed of how your getting on mate. Hope all goes well...

belive me im not backing down on this, been on to toyota uk today about a courtesy car as dealer so say cant strip to diagnose for 2 weeks, which in my eyes is not a great service so far

[Parts-King]

Courtesy cars are exactly what they are. You have no right to demand one. Your dealer does not have a never ending supply of them to loan out, however I'm sure they will do all they can to supply one as soon as possible

Kingo

[jedi134]

The reason why you cant just change the HG on these is because of "Shuffle" Ormi has posed many pic's on the subject! It has to be a new 3/4 engine! If they say the're gonna just change the HG then I'd be asking some very searching questions!!!

Keep us informed of how your getting on mate. Hope all goes well...

Where's these pics mate? Do you have a link :D

[Mistermena]

The reason why you cant just change the HG on these is because of "Shuffle" Ormi has posed many pic's on the subject! It has to be a new 3/4 engine! If they say the're gonna just change the HG then I'd be asking some very searching questions!!!

Keep us informed of how your getting on mate. Hope all goes well...

Where's these pics mate? Do you have a link :D

I've no idea where they are on the forum now mate... Have a look at Ormi posts to find them! very good to see what happens when the HG goes and the reasons why you cant just change the HG!... !Removed! Toyota! Most other cars you can just change the gasket!... :P :D

[gug]

here you go jedi

http://www.toyotaown...et&fromsearch=1

well dont look like im getting CC until they start work, TUK said they will allways look after customers but are unable to react on it until an official stripdown has been done, which i cant ask for much more at the moment. ive also told dealer to ring me once stripped so i can check for pitting in head/block making it scrap.

[jedi134]

Cheers

[Red diesel]

Courtesy cars are exactly what they are. You have no right to demand one. Your dealer does not have a never ending supply of them to loan out, however I'm sure they will do all they can to supply one as soon as possible

Kingo

Fair point Kingo - and if it was for a normal routine service id agree with you - the issue id have however is that this car is off the road until March simply because of a (very) well known design flaw (head gasket) on this 2.2 engine.

Personally in this situation id be happy for Toyota to supply me with a hire car from hertz - but i don't feel a customer should be left with no car whatsowever for weeks as a result of a design/manufacturing issue on the car.

The bottom line in my view is this - this is a manufacturing/design fault by Toyota.

The customer should be able to stay mobile at no extra cost to the customer - yes

a customer can go and hire a car - but they should not be out of pocket.

I realise that courtesy cars don't grow on trees - but i see no reason why Toyota HQ can't organise a hire car through hertz or the like.

I do however have sympathy with dealers - they represent manufacturers like Toyota and sell the cars in good faith. But then issues like this crop up and they are the guys caught in the middle - with an unhappy customer and insufficient support from head office.

Personally i would not sign a franchise with a car manufacturer without getting clauses inserted on what support i will get in order to help my customers who ive sold a manufacturers cars in good faith - should the manufacturer let me down and supply cars with expensive design faults.

I hope you don't take this personally as youve been a great member of the forum and i know that you would do all you could to help your customers out

Red diesel

[Parts-King]

To be fair, most of these engine replacements are planned, the customer is NOT off the road (usually its oil burning) so a loan car would be allocated to the next available slot

ALL warranty claims are manufacturing faults, even if it is a minor job, dealers and Toyota know this very well and in most cases, there is often a workaround such as collection and delivery or while you wait. I agree with you, I'm not trying to be objectionable about loan cars, but there is a limit on what the dealer can provide.

Personally i would not sign a franchise with a car manufacturer without getting clauses inserted on what support i will get in order to help my customers who ive sold a manufacturers cars in good faith - should the manufacturer let me down and supply cars with expensive design faults.

In a commercial world you cannot insert clauses for every eventuality, it would not be possible. The pedal recall being an example. Toyota, DVLA, and the dealer network ALL jumped through hoops to get that problem sorted as fast as humanly possible, many dealers included ourselves worked very long shifts over many weeks to get customers back on the road as soon as possible and without too much disruption, did we loan or hire them all cars? No, we managed it as best as we could with the resources we had and the vast majority of customers appreciated this.

The customer should be able to stay mobile at no extra cost to the customer - yes

a customer can go and hire a car - but they should not be out of pocket.

I agree, where possible, but these engines are way outside the warranty period and being replaced under "Goodwill" There is no requirement for Toyota to do anything at all, but they are because that is the type of company they are

Toyota have in the past provided hire cars, but these will be taken on a case by case basis. I would be speaking to the dealer to see if something could be organised sooner, ask to speak to a manager or dealer principle to see if there is something else that can be done for you. Not many people actually end up "off the road" through warranty repairs, but there are times when delays occur. The engine replacement is exceptional, no other manufacturer would be even considering replacing an engine after 7 years, let alone loan a car to you, but if all else fails, you could try customer relations to see what can be done

Kingo

[Waseem1]

Most other manufactures would not offer anything outside warranty period try dealing with Audi or Ford..or any other manufacturer but saying that its a horrible engine fault

[toffeemen1]

I had the HG go on my corolla verso T180 last october, diagnosed in a day at inchape basingstoke, got a fully paid courtesy car via national rental (zafira! Cant win em all). It took about 3 week for them to fix but most of the time was waiting for new engine block to arrive. My car had done 64k and is an 06 plate with 5 service stamps, they claimed i just met the criteria and made out it was a personal favour to fix it! Overall i found their customer service mixed between great, stuck up and irritating, they called to during the fix and said whilst removing the starter motor the thread had broken due to when it was put on incorrectly so thats £300 for a new one! not happy but what could i do as they have my car in bits. Car seems fine now but i understand your frustration with the dealers inconsistant customer service.

[toffeemen1]

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[toffeemen1]

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[toffeemen1]

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[gug]

well cars back all fixed new 3/4 engine inc water pump, hoooray, but on a bad note on removing wiring loom from 5th injector which had been broken previously cost me £800+vat ouch!

so hopefully happy motoring now